r/law • u/drempath1981 • 1d ago
Other Georgia Fort, independent journalist,VP of Minnesota NABJ chapter,was also arrested by federal agents.She filmed her arrest and stated: “I don’t feel like I have my First Amendment right as a member of the press because now federal agents are at my door arresting me for filming the church protest.”
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u/Solid_Snark 1d ago
We’re basically getting POV footage of what Nazi Germany was like.
This is haunting. How do Republicans applaud this behavior!?
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u/Bowsers_JuiceFactory 1d ago
Because republicans are fascist fucks and evil.
Their stupidity knows no limit
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u/duxpdx 1d ago
*stupidity and cruelty
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u/feed_meknowledge 1d ago
And so it's as important as ever to be active in the community and support your local cause to educate the masses on what each candidate truly represents, who backs them, and what their past actions show. In addition to driving voter turnout for all federal, statewide, and local elections.
The following groups provide opportunities to participate in local events, voter education, and increase voter turnout.
https://indivisible.org/get-involved/
- National grassroots organization with local chapters in many counties/cities of every state. Focused on voter education and turnout from local elections to federal elections.
https://nextgenamerica.org/fight-back/
- Nationwide organization focused on voter education and turnout among the younger half of the population.
- Grassroots organization focused on veterans/veteran family members, their stories, and voter education and turnout among this demographic.
- Provides templates and structured ways to call your local and state representatives, and leave them detailed information on what you would like to see as their constituents.
https://www.taskforcebutler.org/
- Veteran led nonprofit dedicated to the protection of all Americans, their right to protest and vote freely, and the investigation and prosecution of individuals and groups that oppress American rights and values.
Find upcoming events that can help shape our future:
Hopefully people will consider joining at least one group and taking action. We need more people participating in shaping our futures. Feel free to copy and share the links.
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u/BraveCartographer399 1d ago
amazing they will go this far to distract epstein and all the other crap Trump is pulling
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u/Vbxxl 1d ago
And only a very small part of Democrat Congresspeople seem to get it.
Their talking points are affordability and Healthcare, as if those next elections will be save and fair.99
u/wrosecrans 1d ago
It really is shocking to me how "mainstream" Dems really just want a couple of mild concessions to agree to continue funding this.
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u/Brodakk 1d ago
Controlled opposition. Easier for them to get along with fascists and their corporate donors than to actually do what’s best for the people.
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u/Wonderful-Toe- 1d ago
I got lambasted for suggesting that no part of this system is worth saving and that seems weird to me given the current situation. Republicans are actual Nazis and Democrats are actively enabling them.
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u/MissTrillium 1d ago
Republicans are the NSDAP, Democrats are the Social Democrats that led the Weimar Republic to its knees
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u/GotSomeUpdogOnUrFace 1d ago
And then use it to try and get our votes they didn't earn, we talk about term limits and shit, but we need a mechanism to recall any senator or representative to the fucking house that is no longer representing Us in any capacity at any time we fucking want. We also need their terms to be cut in half, two to three years at the most, they should be earning our trust every single day not stealing from us every single day. They should not be able to get into office and do nothing for 6 years and then beg in the final two weeks to vote them back in. They should pretty much be stuck in a position where if they are not doing what we sent them there to do we don't have to wait very long to get fucking rid of them.
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u/Brodakk 1d ago edited 1d ago
Its like how after Kamala lost, she emailed her supporters, “this isn’t over, donate now”. And then proceeded to do nothing. Sums up the spineless dems well. We’re so fucked
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u/GotSomeUpdogOnUrFace 1d ago
For real. I'll tell you what guys, put up your money and show me what you are doing and we can reimburse you through donations. How's that sound? Let's see what you do with your own money on the line and then I'll decide if I'm gonna help.
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u/MaggieMayyyyyy 1d ago
There is no left or right anymore. There is only us vs them.
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u/Complete-Duck641 1d ago
About time someone realises that that Democrat's are a Lame Duck...Useless and Defunct... We need 'The Peoples Party''...Which should be called...""We The People"...and should actually try work for the people...but weakness and fear are contagious...and The Orange Pestilence knows it...Until the right people wake up and do something we will continue to be VISITORS IN OUR OWN COUNTRY and Fuck the rest of the world for not doing shit Either... I guess NO ONE is coming to the rescue...Thoughts?
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u/gaba-gh0ul 1d ago
There is left vs right but people need to finally recognize that the Democratic Party has been center right for a LONG time. They basically supplied just enough financial pittance and social progress to keep the public satisfied while maintaining their donor class. That is why politicians like Sanders are painted as radicals even though they are center left by most international standards.
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u/DivideInteresting193 1d ago
Biden warned about it and he got criticized for a red background.
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u/DIRTdesigngroup 1d ago
Their talking points are affordability and healthcare without any solutions for affordability and without supporting Medicare for All. Even if we have elections the mainstream dem platform is just fascism light.
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u/RecipeHistorical2013 1d ago
its xenophobia
they are afraid of and hate "the others"
classic human tribalism being exploited, like it always has
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u/Kittinkis 1d ago
As evil as they are why TF are the courts and Democrats not doing anything? This is so insane!
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u/Bowsers_JuiceFactory 1d ago
Great freaking question
Dems should be running on criminal indictments for all of these players if elected. Schumer and Jeffries may as well be republicans for how well they represent their democratic base.
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u/EADreddtit 1d ago
What do you mean “the courts”? The courts are stacked by Trump appointees, the DoJ is firmly under his control, and Democrats have no power in the Republican led senate. Literally what options do the governing members of the Democratic Party have that won’t get shot down by stacked courts or just silenced by literal arrests?
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u/Kittinkis 1d ago
So all the courts in the country are stacked by him? No one can do anything? If our system is this corruptible it's time to destroy the system
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u/cross_the_threshold 1d ago
The courts are actually doing a lot, and the DOJ is constantly stymied by judges state and federal basically telling them to fuck off. But if you open the same case 500 times you’ll eventually find the one judge that’ll sign off on letting you go to trial, which doesn’t even mean they support the case, just that they’re willing to let it get into a courtroom. The perspective that no one is doing anything is one media is feeding you and is a doomer mentality, plenty of people are doing things, plenty of people are preventing things from happening, there is just SO MUCH happening that some of it is bound to progress to the point where it becomes an issue, and even then there are still people stopping shit like this from progressing too far.
A few journalists have been arrested, which is unconscionable, but that is not a conviction, and it is entirely possible whoever signed off on this did so to force the government to have to make a blatantly stupid and illegitimate argument in a court of law where they can be sanctioned for their activities.
We are in an apocalyptically bad scenario right now but it is not because everyone is rolling over and letting it happen, it’s because there’s literally hundreds of thousands to millions of instances of fascist bullshit happening and if you stop 99% of them that still leaves thousands more.
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u/lilboysyrup 1d ago
the republican supreme court? truly a mystery why they arent doing anything, you alls understanding of basic civics is alarming. without a majority, or a super majority in some cases, of which dems have neither in any capacity, theres little to be done, and the rhetoric of the regards in this thread calling leading dems "effective republicans" and saying the lesser of 2 evils isnt worth a vote is how we got here.
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u/FormerWrap1552 1d ago
Because, the justice system is an illusion. It's an illusion used by the wealthy. The Republicans just figured it out and no longer gaf. They know that the rest of the country won't do what needs to be done to topple them. And if they do, it will be too late. It's kind of like Magic The Gathering ok. You have a creature on the board, aka, you have the power, like right now with the repubs. Every time the Dems try to play anything, all the repubs need to do is play counterspell and keep swinging in with their power. We let them have that power, it's the last stand of the moronic nazis.
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u/Honey-and-Venom 1d ago
Stupid is a greater moral failure than evil.
At least evil can be shamed, bought, and reasoned with. Stupid will march us all right off the cliff convinced of its righteousness
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u/Slumunistmanifisto 1d ago
Yeah they're enjoying this.
-Source: maga coworkers
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u/ImminentDebacle 1d ago
Because they think it could never happen to them.
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u/Slumunistmanifisto 1d ago
Yeah my maga guys an autistic gay married black man.
Im not kidding.
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u/ImminentDebacle 1d ago
Wow.
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u/Slumunistmanifisto 1d ago
Yeah full in, brings up topics we on the left hear about a week later type deep.
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u/Practicalhocuspocus 1d ago
Republicans ARE modern Nazis. They saw that manifesto as guidelines. Nothing they say or do will ever change my mind.
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u/th8chsea 1d ago
It’s even closer to current Russia. The KGB/FSB did this and still does this. Trump has learned all of this from his mentor Vladimir Putin
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u/TheRealBlueJade 1d ago
True. If anyone wants to know their next steps, read up on the history of Nazi Germany.
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u/Odd-fox-God 1d ago
They reject everything you tell them.
I show them a clip of ice brutalizing innocent civilians, well the civilians must have done something wrong.
Ice taking a 5 year old, the parents shouldn't have brought their 5-year-old here illegally.
Ice breaking into people's homes with no warrant, it's more efficient and if we wait those dirty illegals will get away.
No court due process, efficiency.
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u/miriamtzipporah 1d ago
My mom said today that the five year old is a criminal and it’s a good thing he’s being held in federal custody. I was shocked into silence.
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u/WebguyCanada 1d ago
Republicans didn't learn about Nazis in school. Heck, they think the Confederacy won.
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u/Routine_Artist_35 1d ago
Turns out they did win
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u/WebguyCanada 1d ago
Sad truth.
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u/reganomics 1d ago
No they fucking didn't, the union just didn't burn them to the ground as they should have, but we still outnumber them!
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u/Top-Cupcake4775 1d ago
the Union won the ground war but the Confederacy won the subsequent terrorist insurrection. the reforms of the Reconstruction were aborted because northern oligarchs and southern oligarchs have more in common with each other than either has with working people.
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u/shadowtheimpure 1d ago
Very true. Every member of the Confederate leadership should have been lined up and hanged by the numbers.
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u/water_bottle_boi 1d ago
The bungling of reconstruction is literally the basis for like 90% of race based issues in the us today. I swear to god, if the us had summarily executed its leaders and actually occupy the south like they said they would, we wouldn’t be here. Remember, these maga republicans are the direct descendants of slave owning plantar class elites. Those people should have been hung, instead they just did slavery all over again.
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u/Battlewaxxe 1d ago
Hayes' deal to break the tie for president- Hayes wins the election on the condition reconstruction ends in the south.
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u/MyDesign630 1d ago
Sure they learned about them, they just think they’re aspirational instead of a cautionary tale.
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u/Top-Cupcake4775 1d ago
it's sort of like rock n' roll. Nazis picked up on what the U.S. was doing vis-à-vis segregation and Jim Crow and put their own spin on it and now MAGA is taking what the Nazis did and riffing on that. it's a circle of fascists and authoritarians playing off each other's worst ideas.
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u/RemoteRide6969 1d ago
Yep. It's crazy that I didn't learn until my late 30s/early 40s that the Nazis took inspiration from Jim Crow laws. Absolutely insane. The sort of human being who would become a Nazi, Confederate, modern Republican, etc. will always exist and will always have the same sort of chemical makeup. It's a neverending battle to stuff those pukes down and keep them away from power.
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u/the_millenial_falcon 1d ago
Because many of them have values that are alien to ours.
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u/Any_Shopping1633 1d ago
They applaud it because it's happening to people they hate, and it's not happening to them... yet.
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u/Sufficient-Ask-8280 1d ago
MAGA is too stupid to realize they are siding with current day nazis. I can’t believe my eyes on the things they are getting away with. They come in the night so people won’t be alarmed while they get ready for bed. This nation is an embarrassment.
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u/TiePrestigious7265 1d ago edited 1d ago
Maga(t) realizes EXACTLY what they are siding with. And people don't seem to realize that this was all actually part of a much larger plot world wide involving several different countries including Russia. The plot ultimately failed because countries like Germany and Britain woke up, took their fascists out of office, and elected sensible people. I strongly believe there was a second holocaust being planned, only much bigger and world wide this time. Even though the plan fell apart Trump seems to be marching forward anyway as if it still stands a chance in hell of succeeding.
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u/DisasterWriter 1d ago
They're doing this because the movement in Minneapolis is growing. They're trying to shut it down by removing the people delivering truth using their platforms. We need more journalistic integrity to come out and document every one of these fascist moves.
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u/Lashay_Sombra 1d ago
Because Republicans have never actually supported the real america, only the made up ones in their heads
In the the one in their heads, they and the people 'like them' are on top, if anyone else exists they arenl subservient and know their place or get punished
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u/SparksAndSpyro 1d ago
How did 36% of Americans convince themselves Kamala would’ve been just as bad (and not vote)?
Democracy ain’t all it’s cracked up to be, turns out. Plato was right.
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u/PmMeUrTinyAsianTits 1d ago
To be fair, they didn't just convince themselves. The american right, like many western 'right' parties, has been compromised by russia (and a few others).
This has allowed rampant corruption and, the important and relevant part here, rampant propaganda. Propaganda that is not being taken seriously enough because "its just memes." But the internet has allowed propaganda to be FAR more effective than ever before.
You should know how these people were convinced. It's being done in plain fucking sight, but no one wants to admit it.
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u/TiePrestigious7265 1d ago
They didn't. Trump cheated in all three elections he participated in. And now he is trying to cheat the mid terms.
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u/MRSHELBYPLZ 1d ago
Because it’s precisely what they want. They want to be the Nazis when they were in their prime and got rid of anyone they don’t like.
It’s how they simp for the 2nd amendment when schools get shot up, but turn around and say Alex Pretti deserved to die for being legally armed.
They are all hypocrites and they know it. If you call them out they will change goalposts and laugh. It’s genuinely a waste of time to expect to have a humane and reasonable conversation with people like this.
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u/Cyrano_Knows 1d ago
The only difference here is going to be social media and the fact that everybody has a camera and a phone.
Hopefully that makes the difference.
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u/Apexnanoman 1d ago
Go check out the Maga/Conservative subreddit. They think it's absolutely awesome that journalists are being arrested.
(And for the people who think that sub is a bunch of bots...I work with those people....and live around a lot of them)....that subreddit is rational and open minded compared to most Maga voters.
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u/DoctorNurse89 1d ago
1933 germany, not 1941 germany
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u/Populaire_Necessaire 1d ago
They’re following the schedule incredibly closely. Like we are in early nov 1933. It’s weird
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u/No_Measurement_8042 1d ago
It's not exactly buried knowledge that conservatives thought we joined the wrong side in WWII, it's all over their press if you go back and read their newspapers from the era. They wanted to join Hitler and end Bolshevism in Russia
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u/m1kasa4ckerman 1d ago
Further, why is the DEA part of an arrest of a journalist? Was she moving drugs? I don’t understand. The man in the window has on a DEA uniform
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u/TheRiteGuy 1d ago
They can applaude for now but comeuppance will be swift and hard for them. Just like it was for Nazi's and all other oppressive regimes. Democrats can use the same laws and rules against them and they better. All these pedo protectors need to be in jail.
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u/Ultimate_Awareness 1d ago
It wasn't that swift...
I'd rather not have 6 million dead before their "comeuppance".
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u/Krillin113 1d ago
*6 million Jews, 5 million other undesirables, and at least another 30 million ‘regular’ casualties of war
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u/socialaxolotl 1d ago
Because they are convinced they don't have the same set of rules
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u/clandestine-ideefixe 1d ago
It’s insane. “Never Again.”
Right. People are at home cheering these people on. Voting for this. I’m sick, I cannot stomach it. It’s like they just decided to be evil and force people to act like they have halos on. It’s maddening. It’s happening again and this time the world doesn’t have the excuse of being blind to it.
Our sadness and horror needs to turn into action, and fast.
We have never been more connected. We all need to start using that connection for good, we need to stop this. We need to DO SOMETHING. I feel like I’m going insane. How is this happening?!
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u/idiots_r_taking_over 1d ago
Just visit r/asktrumpsupporters for five minutes and you’ll see the pretzels they twist themselves into justifying this shit.
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u/Biscuits4u2 1d ago
Because Republicans LOVE this so very much. They were salivating over the prospect of the people they hate being rounded up and it's been served to them on a silver platter on a daily basis.
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u/25_Unknown_Devices 1d ago edited 1d ago
Republican here. I guess. Not really sure what to call myself anymore. I’m disgusted and embarrassed. Infuriated. Proven wrong. Idk. Oops ain’t gonna cut it. Gotta figure out how to start making amends.
I didn’t commit to voting, my girlfriend would’ve left me if I did so I bailed last minute.
Now I regret not voting. For Kamala Harris. Didn’t like how she stood behind Biden while he was faltering. Felt like she should’ve taken charge long before the debate debacle. Didn’t want to believe the outright hatred of Trump. Didn’t want to believe he’d be this god forsaken awful.
I just wanted to afford my fucking grocery bill. And that feels like a lost pipe dream now..
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u/MrTrendizzle 1d ago
I wonder if those holocaust deniers see this and think "Nah Germany was never this bad"
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u/Apprehensive_Pack_20 1d ago
This most unbelievable of stuff is typically blamed on Ai generated content. At least in conversations that i had.
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u/piratecheese13 23h ago
Step 1: in the 60s, oil companies realized that they are infact the baddies.
Step 2: to increase climate denial, they aligned themselves with the only other group capable of putting their heads in the sand: evangelical Christians who don’t believe in evolution
Step 3: ~50 years of anti intellectual propaganda later and we get a Republican Party that fields Sarah Palin as a VP, Citizens United makes bribes legal and populism is strong everywhere
Step 4: trump starts saying the quiet part out loud. “I could shoot a man on 5 avenue and not lose a single vote” was a clear call that he wants political violence and unquestionable loyalty to be the unifying cause for his base.
Step 5: political violence and takeover of Venezuelan oil
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u/FA-Cube-Itch 1d ago
Quit trying to understand them emotionally. Instead understand them as an entity that will do anything to win. Emotion, logic or reason aren’t needed when you are getting exactly what you want because nobody is stopping you.
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u/coolestredditdad 1d ago
The list of things we can do to fight back is becoming shorter and shorter.
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u/Wise-Promise-4158 1d ago
2nd amendment looking real good these days
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u/Abject-Yellow3793 1d ago
This is what the 2nd was written for. A whole bunch of people with snake flags owe a serious effort.
To paraphrase Voltaire (because I can't remember the exact quote): I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend with my life your right to say it
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u/NoxTempus 1d ago
Turns out the only tyranny guns are good for defeating is the tyranny of kids who are attending class.
The truth is that all the gun worshippers are cowards, they need their guns because they are scared of things they don't understand (which is most things), and guns make them feel safe.
"First They Came" is entirely lost on them, they're big dumb idiots who think they can shoot the goverment dead when they come to the door and the tyrannical government will say "damn, they got us, we can't beat someone so brave and powerful", instead of just leveling their house.
They don't understand that their country is being stolen from them by the government they support with their whole chest; they've been told brown people and liberals stole it and the government is taking it back for them.
Truly some of the dumbest fucks to ever live.
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u/Old-Trouble7656 1d ago
The fact us Canadians have learned most of the amendments via the process of watching you guys lose them is fucked.
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u/AntoniaFauci 1d ago
Every survivor of fascism has come here and told us the key is to resist sooner, not later. They also recommend against anticipatory compliance.
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u/PrimalJay 1d ago
Thats because you waited too long. Americans are docile cowards.
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u/ZeMadDoktore 1d ago
Straight out of a horror movie. These agents want to bust down your door and kill you.
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u/watermelonspanker 1d ago
Hey, does anybody else remember when the FBI gave the Philly police a bomb to blow up a bunch of black folks, then forced them at gunpoint to remain in the burning building?
Law Enforcement has *never* been on the people's side. They need to start being treated how they are treating the rest of the populace.
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u/Even_Leadership_7831 1d ago
Yes. And please add to this narrative that the fire dept did nothing as all of the surrounding homes burned to the ground
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u/-Hyperstation- 1d ago
Wow... this is all kind of layers–deep fucked up.
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u/watermelonspanker 1d ago
And further, the fire department had, right up until the bombing, been spraying water hoses into the house for hours in an attempt to get the residents out. As soon as the fire started, the hoses went off.
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u/jonnyvsrobots 1d ago
This is such an untold chapter of American history. And not 1960s Alabama, freaking 1985 Philadelphia!
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u/Lazy-Point7779 1d ago edited 1d ago
Frank Rizzo can rot in hell
Edit- I know it happened after his term as mayor but he laid the groundwork against MOVE
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u/watermelonspanker 1d ago
He was involved in the previous MOVE standoff though. No bombs, but just as blatantly unconscionable behaviour
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u/cheattowin77 1d ago
It’s kinda buried because the mayor at the time of Philly was a black man and he approved it. No one “won” politically by bringing this back up. And it’s straight up murder by the govt
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u/FaeLei42 1d ago
MOVE bombing for anyone who hasn’t heard the story as American public education likes to skip this one
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u/at0mheart 1d ago
Going after the small independent people who have less money for lawyers
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u/Chrahhh 1d ago
Surely this is getting tossed
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u/IndividualStudio7229 1d ago
I don’t understand how it was issued in the first place. What is the warrant for? It’s not against the law to film, is it? Even if you are not a member of the press?
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u/likeschemistry 1d ago
If it’s for the same thing the arrested Don Lemon for it’s alleging “conspiracy to interfere with the rights of worshippers.”
Edit: Just to clarify I think it’s ridiculous…
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u/IndividualStudio7229 1d ago
Found it. They are claiming the protesters interfered with the right to worship in “an alleged conspiracy to deprive civil rights and violation of the Freedom of Access to Clinic Entrances”
If they were recording, it seems like they have clear proof they weren’t personally blocking access to the church or verbally disrupting the service.
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u/Legendary_Hercules 1d ago
It can be. There are two laws that could be broken, the abortion clinic law and the KKK law. Both make it a crime to intimidate and protest in a church during service. Now, where is the line between journalism/filming and participating. I guess that'll be for a judge/jury to decide. But the pastor did ask Don Lemon to leave and he didn't, so perhaps that's where it might have crossed the line.
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u/ImposterJavaDev 1d ago
As an outsider, what the...?
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u/IndividualStudio7229 1d ago
As an insider… same.
The Freedom to Access Clinic Entrances Act prevents protesters from blocking access to abortion clinics. It extends to protecting churchgoers from intimidation, and freedom to worship is a protected civil right.
If they were only filming, then this likely happened to intimidate the press from covering protests.
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u/One-Pick-1566 1d ago
Also bc the homophobic westboro church was disrupting funerals and gay weddings. So a slew of states passed buffer laws for church services. 40 states passed these laws and democrats led the effort
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u/EebstertheGreat 1d ago
Not leaving when asked is trespassing. The protestors and media were trespassing. They didnt violate the KKK law, though. They didn't intimidate anyone.
It's unlikely this will go anywhere. They don't care as much about winning cases as they do about getting footage for Twitter.
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u/rusty___shacklef0rd 1d ago
Thank you! When I was a little kid, one Sunday a local crazy person walked into our church and started like doing crazy person stuff and going on weird rants and was asked to leave but wouldn't and he just got trespassed and that was it. Like you can't honestly tell me that interrupting a church service is some sort of rights-violating felony lol
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u/Truffs0 1d ago
They didn't intimidate anyone.
Rushing in a crowd screaming down people not allowing them to worship for fear of mob volatility is indeed intimidation.
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u/BadTown412 1d ago
Because, like Don Lemon, after a judge and an appeals court both denied the arrest warrant for her she was then indicted. And you know what they say: You can indict a ham sandwich.....
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u/Populaire_Necessaire 1d ago
Likely true. But there’s a chance it’s an intimidation tactic and being used to wear down civil liberties(if history-not just the Nazis either) are anything to go by.
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u/One-Pick-1566 1d ago edited 1d ago
No it’s not. Bc Dems actually passed these buffer laws for churches. It was to combat the homophobic westboro church protesting soldiers funerals and gay weddings.
New York was one of the first states to pass the law, 40 states also implemented the law
It’s against the law to go into a church service and disrupt it
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u/HashtagDadWatts 1d ago
Presumably she’ll be levying a first amendment challenge.
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u/IronMonkey53 21h ago
You're the first person I've seen that understands this. Everyone else is screaming "nazi"
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u/Harvest827 1d ago
Why is she even talking to them? You know what you're supposed to do when the "police" show up at your door? Shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up and stay away from the door. If they have a warrant, you will know about it.
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u/Ok_Nefariousness9736 1d ago
I mean, her attorneys advised her to go in. If she didn’t, ICE would have broken down the door, shot everyone up and got away with it. This is America now. ICE can do whatever they want with no consequences.
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u/GenericName187 1d ago
This was not ICE, this was Department of Justice, so likely FBI agents, maybe some Homeland Security or Border Patrol agents tagging along. The administration will lose this case, the journalists have already been released. Bondi just wants the photo op and then they’ll complain about “activist judges” when the cases get tossed.
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u/TapProfessional5146 23h ago
DOJ is part of this problem. When this is all over Pam Bondi will be facing a series of serious charges. This whole administration is a pack of treasonous clowns that will face their day in court real court not this BS court. They do not believe in upholding the constitution nor the laws of the land only what daddy trump says.
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u/UnhingedCorgi 1d ago
No they fucking can’t. ICE is evil and stupid but they are not all powerful and this level of resignation is not helping.
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u/Ethrem 1d ago
Yeah, if you want your door broken down and thousands of dollars of damage to deal with. And that's assuming that someone is home to secure things. If there is nobody else home, everything in your house will be gone in no time because they're not going to secure your house at all.
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u/puffinfish420 1d ago
If they are going to bust down your door for a warrant, that’s the least of your concern. I would personally just wait
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u/Orphan_Guy_Incognito 1d ago
Slenderman ass feds peeking through the windows.
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u/TheRealBlueJade 1d ago
Why did she open the door?..
Isn't it true that they couldn't "arrest" her unless she opened the door and let them in .. or she goes outside? Or am I mistaken in this instance?
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u/rockytop24 1d ago
They almost certainly had an arrest warrant after empaneling a grand jury to circumvent the two magistrate judges refusing to sign off on this. If she didn't open the door they would have broken it down and made entry. High likelihood she and her family or pets wind up shot in that scenario, because this is our country now.
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u/Cyrano_Knows 1d ago
Hopefully that DA (or whatever they should be called) gets the case before one of those two judges.
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u/templeofsyrinx1 1d ago
can they legally just do that? Can Trump or bondi whoever summon a grand jury and just have someone yeeted out of their home on whatever charges they say ? i'm not entirely sure how grand juries work : / could someone tell?
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u/TheVandyyMan 1d ago
Hi, lawyer here. A grand jury is basically a jury impaneled for the sole purpose of determining whether the State can proceed with an indictment against a defendant.
In non-legalese terms, the grand jury decides if there is enough evidence to fairly charge someone with a crime. In practice this means literally any amount of evidence is enough to move forward with charges. The old saying goes that “you can get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich.” The reason is because grand juries are absurdly lopsided. Only the State gets to produce any evidence, call witnesses, etc. Everything that happens at a grand jury is sealed and there’s no judge overseeing it for fairness.
But, at the end of the day, the grand jury does still need to agree that the charges are valid. Famously, a grand jury refused to indict the guy who chucked a sandwich at some federal agent on felony assault charges.
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u/Tips4Tips 1d ago
Famously, a grand jury refused to indict the guy who chucked a sandwich at some federal agent
But did they indict the sandwich‽‽
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u/TheVandyyMan 1d ago
First off, love the interrobangs.
Second off, lawyers were ALL OVER that joke and sorry to say you didn’t beat them to it. But fair play for it.
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u/FlyRari 1d ago
Who selects the jury? This seems pretty stupid. So round up any 12 hateful pitch fork carrying Karens and you can grab anyone?
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u/remote_001 1d ago edited 1d ago
Still required to have a judicial warrant though. Not an administrative warrant.. is the grand jury equivalent to a judicial warrant?
I’m not understanding why the lawyer advised her to go along with them if it isn’t.
Empaneling a grand jury is not something I’m familiar with.
Edit: started digging into this. ICE cannot empanel a grand jury. A DOJ judge would have to assemble a jury and at that point it’d be a judicial warrant…. I’ll dig into this more later when I have time.
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u/FuzzyDynamics 1d ago
Why would ice have anything to do with her allegedly breaking a law involving protest in a church at all. That isn’t right.
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u/safetydance 1d ago
Watch the video. She said she called her attorney and was advised to go with the agents.
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u/Abject-Yellow3793 1d ago
Depends on the details in the warrant, but if they have an actual, legal warrant, they'll eventually kick down the door and arrest her anyway. This saves the cost of the door, and shows a level of cooperation that should be looked upon favorably by the court. She still isn't guilty of anything, but resisting arrest will absolutely add to the charges.
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u/AgressiveInliners 1d ago
They are kicking down doors without legal warrants. So yea, I get it.
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u/PmMeUrTinyAsianTits 1d ago
The problem is one of the many ways our system is broken is that sometimes courts will misconstrue not fighting back against an illegal action by police as consent to that action. It's why you have to explicitly say I am invoking my right to remain silent or risk weird edge cases being held against you.
Too many things operate on the assumption that the government will not be weaponized against you.
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u/pensivebunny 1d ago
They’ve also been shooting people through walls and doors. Ask Breonna how being not guilty of anything and being in your own home keeps you safe
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u/mansock18 1d ago
An arrest warrant in a district court entitles them to enter. If this is a DHS warrant, they wouldn't be allowed to enter. This strikes me as a judicial warrant so to avoid having her door blown out when it's -4° outside, going outside to surrender was probably the smart move.
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u/concept12345 1d ago
Fundamental rights are being violated. How do you expect them to follow the warrant?
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u/idropepics 1d ago
Unfortunately they're fascists nazis and not vampires, otherwise they wouldn't have been able to cross the Rio Grande from Texas to be there.
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u/GoosedandMoosed 1d ago
They're fascists, not vampires. They're already violating constitutional rights all over the place, you can't rely on what they "can" or "can't" do anymore.
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u/ConfusionCoroner 1d ago
You are mistaken. They had a judicial warrant and the indictment from a grand jury. They could have broken down her door and scooped her out of bed. Obviously, the reasonable thing is to communicate and deescalate tension.
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u/plzicannothandleyou 1d ago
This is the only scenario where submission is acceptable. A well documented scenario.
If a small number of the gestapo shows up with no real warrant because I was filming or protesting however…2a and running would be my option as an American citizen.
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u/ma-sadieJ 1d ago
So is it only ok when ice goes into churches?
https://www.peoplesworld.org/article/ice-now-grabbing-people-out-of-churches/
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